[FROM JOHN WESLEY'S MISCELLANEOUS WORKS.]
By John Wesley
BETWEEN A PREDESTINARIAN AND HIS FRIEND.
"Out of thine own mouth." FRIEND.—Did God then fore-ordain the sins of any man? PREDESTINARIAN.—"Both the reprobates and the elect were foreordained to sin, as sin, that the glory of God might be declared thereby." (Zanchius de Nat. Dei. p. 555.) "The reprobates" more especially, "who were predestinated to damnation and the causes of damnation, and created to that end, that they may live wickedly, and be vessels full of the dregs of sin." (Piscator Contra Tauffium, p. 47.) F.—But surely the sins of the elect were not fore-ordained? P.—Yes, but they were; "For we neither can do more good than we do, nor less evil than we do; because God from eternity has precisely decreed that both the good and the evil should be so done." (Piscatoris Responsio ad Amicam Duplicationem Comradi Vorstii p. 176.) F.—I understand you as to God's decreeing sin. But how is his irresistible power now concerned in the sins of men? P.—"God is the author of that action, which is sinful, by his irresistible will." (Dr. Twisse, pars 3, p. 21.) P.—"God procures adultery, cursings, lyings." "He supplies wicked men with opportunities of sinning, and inclines their hearts thereto. He blinds, deceives, and seduces them. He, by his working on their hearts, bends and stirs them up to do evil." (Pet. Martyr. Ver. Comment, in Rom. pp. 36, 413.) "And thus thieves, murderers, and other malefactors are God's instruments which he uses to execute what he hath decreed in himself." (Calv. Inst. b. 1, c. 17, s. 5.) F.—Do you not then charge God himself with sin? P.—No: "God necessitates them only to the act of sin, not to the deformity of sin." (Twissi Vindiciae, pars 3, p. 22.) Besides, "when God makes angels or men sin, he does not sin himself, because he does not break any law. For God is under no law, and therefore cannot sin." (Zuinglius in Serm. de Provid. c. 5, 6.) F.—But how does God make angels or men to sin? P.—"The devil and wicked men are so held in on every side with the hand of God, that they cannot conceive, or contrive, or execute any mischief, any farther than God himself doth not permit only, but command. Nor are they only held in fetters, but compelled also, as with a bridle, to perform obedience to those commands." (Calv. Inst. b. 1, c. 17, s. 11) F.—This is true Turkish doctrine, and ought so to be exploded as that used to be in these words:— "I do anathematize the blasphemy of Mohammed, which saith that God deceiveth whom he will, and whom he will he leadeth to that which is good. Himself doeth what he willeth, and is himself the cause of all good and all evil. Fate and destiny govern all things." (Niceius Saracenita.) P.—Nay, our doctrine is more ancient than Mohammed; it was maintained by St. Augustine. F.—Augustine speaks sometimes for it, and sometimes against it. But all antiquity for the four first centuries is against you, as is the whole Eastern Church to this day; and the Church of England, both in her Catechism, Articles, and Homilies. And so are divers of our most holy martyrs. Bishop Hooper and Bishop Latimer in particular. P.—But does not antiquity say, Judas was predestinated to damnation? F.—Quite the contrary. St. Chrysostom's express words are, "Judas, my beloved, was at first a child of the kingdom, and heard it said to him with the disciples, 'Ye shall sit on twelve thrones'; but afterwards he became a child of hell." P.—However you will own that Esau was predestinated to destruction. F.—Indeed I will not. Some of your own writers believe he was finally saved, which was the general opinion of the ancient fathers. And that scripture, "Jacob have I loved, and Esau have I hated," plainly relates not to their persons but their posterities. But, supposing Esau or Judas to be damned, what is he damned for? Pred.—Without question, for unbelief. For as we are saved by faith alone, so unbelief is the only damning sin. F.—By what faith are you saved? P.—By faith in Christ, who gave himself for me. F.—But did he give himself for Esau and Judas? If not, you say they are damned for not believing a lie. This consideration it was which forced Archbishop Usher to cry out, "What would not a man fly unto, rather than yield that Christ did not die for the reprobates; and that none but the elect had any kind of title to him; and yet many thousands should be bound in conscience to believe that he died for them, and tied to accept him for their Redeemer and Saviour? Whereby they should have believed that which in itself is most untrue, and laid hold of that in which they had no kind of interest." P.—But what then do you mean by the words, election and reprobation? F.—I mean this; First God did decree from the beginning to elect or choose, in Christ, all that should believe to salvation. And this decree proceeds from his own goodness, and is not built upon any goodness in the creature. Secondly: God did from the beginning decree to reprobate all who should obstinately and finally continue in unbelief. P.—What then do you think of absolute, unconditional election and reprobation? F.—I think it cannot be found in holy writ, and that it is a plant which bears dismal fruit. An instance of which we have in Calvin himself; who confessed that he procured the burning to death of Michael Servetus, purely for differing from him in opinion in matters of religion.